Ep. 2: Deep dive into Jill & Shakira

Shakira: I could hit leave meeting

Jill: No. This this is the perfect this is the perfect start to our second episode. Because you did prelude to this saying this might be the last. Yeah, how I might feel about this podcast. So here we are.

Shakira: Yeah. Morning Jill. Afternoon. What time is it?

Jill: Who knows? Yeah, who knows? Ah, all right. It is Saturday. So this episode, we're going to talk about diving a little bit deeper into who you and I are. Uh huh. Uh huh. So you were preparing questions? Yeah. And we already talked about this, we already talked about this preparation. So where do you want to begin today?

Shakira: Um, so let me just start by saying, I'm trying to approach this as if I don't know you, which is really difficult. Like, I think I know the answers to all the questions I would ask you, but it's not about me. So maybe there's some, but okay, no, it is about me. Maybe there are some questions I would like to know of you today. Now that I don't know about you. That I would like some answers to. I want some answers, Jill.

Jill: Well, don't we? Oh. I'm ready. I'm feeling like I'm in the hot seat.

Shakira: Yeah. Yeah, I need the problem with oh, what's that?

Jill: I said, I feel like you need some lip gloss for this. But go ahead. I'm ready.

Shakira: Oh, I actually had to lube up before I got on here. And I realized that that's probably something I want to have on the side. You know, just like water lip gloss. That's how I feel about life. Water, lip gloss, coffee.

Jill: These are the things we need to get through moment to moment. Yes. I'm good with that.

Shakira: So, I do, I feel like I know a lot about you, but maybe there's something I don't know.

Jill: Okay. I'm super nervous.

Shakira: And, oh, okay. I have one for you.

Jill: Oh, God. I'm ready.

Shakira: This is good. This is a warm up.

Jill: Oh God. If this is how I feel for the warm up. I'm not sure I'm prepared for the full question.

Shakira: We'll take it easy. You know, I'll a little foreplay, little preheat the oven. Little warm it up.

Jill: I'm heated.

Shakira: You know, coming in, I won't come in hot. What did you dream about last night?

Jill: Oh, wow. I honestly don't know that I remember my dream from last night. I think I slept really super hard. I went to bed late. I was really, really tired. So I don't know that I, I don't, in this moment, I don't remember what I dreamed dreamt about last night.

Shakira: Okay, scratch that question. I have a better one here. What are the top three thoughts that live, will say, rent free as the kids say, in your head. So I'll give you an example. Sure. If I have too much idle time, like today, for example, after this podcast, I don't really have any plans. And there comes a point when not having plans can be a little dangerous for me. Which we can talk about the idea of rest and recovery, you know, all day long. But I would say that there are a handful of thoughts that, you know, sort of ruminate in my head most days, whether I like it or not. So maybe it's not today, or most days, maybe it's as of late recently. What are some of the maybe not random thoughts, but some of the thoughts that are sort of ruminating in your head at this juncture?

Jill: At this juncture in my life? Yeah, yeah. I am with you in the idea that if I have too much free time, I get caught up in loneliness. And so I do the things that make me feel safe and comfortable. And I go back to how I felt safe and comfortable when I was a kid which is put me in front of the television. I will watch that all day long. And then I will just eat whatever food is in my house. So this, therefore, I don't keep shit food in my house because I would weigh 300 or 400 pounds. Because I really there it's it's kind of is a paradox, right word, where I enjoy television. Like it's something that I like to do, but it's also something that is really hard for me once I get started to get out of because I fall into the story. And I want to continue in that story. I don't want it to stop. So therefore I will binge all day long watching the entire season because I want the story. And like next week, Jeff is leaving for a week. So therefore I'm alone, I have nobody to be responsible to except for two dogs that may or may not have to go outside. Yeah, they can go out on my whim. So I need to find things for me to do so that I'm not sitting in front of the television all day long. And even if I have projects on my to do list, it will be like, well, I'll just do it later. Because I'm just gonna watch this episode, I'm only gonna watch this for like an hour, and then I'm gonna get to work. And then it's two hours, three hours. So for me, the first one that what ruminates for me is loneliness. How can I comfort myself in loneliness?

Shakira: Mm hmm. You set a couple of things that meet me that stuck out to me or that I interpreted them, sort of in my brain. And that was using something, television in this scenario, as wanting to get caught up in the story. And so the word that comes to mind for me is distraction, wanting to distract myself. Now, I'm curious what you, one are distracting yourself from what is it, if anything, if that is a true interpretation of you know, the escaping part of the television. Loneliness is a big one for me, which I want to put that aside, but the other thing that I heard that really stuck out to me was what I'm interpreting as this procrastination of the tasks or the things or the projects or whatever it may be, especially when there's, you know, space, without, you know, some will say, some structured activity, whatever that might be. And I heard something recently, and you can react to either one of those things like the distraction part, or the procrastination sort of words there. But I heard something recently, relative to procrastination, that I've been thinking about a lot recently, and that's around how procrastinating things that we know we need to do that will say, for me serve my higher self prevents me from being of service to other people. So by putting something off, you know, today, or the next day or the next day, that means I'm I have less ability to be available to support or love or build the things that I will say set for my 2023 intentions. And a lot of that has to do with relationships with others. Because I have this relationship with myself of putting things off that don't that doesn't honor my my higher self. And that's been a real big thought sort of swing in my head. As of lately. I will say it's motivated me a little more to sort of get my shit you know done during the day. But I think that's going to be a never ending goal. So anyway, those are the two things that I started sticking out to me in response to your, your response.

Jill: Yeah. And I would say yes to all of that. It is a distraction for procrastination. And for me what you had said in the procrastination, about procrastinating of being in service of others, because then for me that that puts the puts responsibility on me to have to show up for myself first. Yes. So in all of that, I would say everything that I do for distraction, procrastination numbing, is so that I don't have to be with myself. Yes. And so therefore the relationship of myself is the thing that I'm working on the hardest, and most intently, because I think over the last X amount of years, I've worked on all kinds of things about myself. But now that I've created this space for my own freedom in finding that piece, it's like, okay, well, sure, I have this freedom to have this time. But now what am I doing with all of this time? What's at the core of all of this and you and I have talked about this as of late. And so everything comes back to me, because now I need to be responsible for me. Before I can, I need to be connected and have a great relationship with myself in order for me to be of service to others because I do realize that, that is my my soul's journey and my souls like purpose is to heal thyself and inspire others to do the same with the way that I'm doing it. Right. So yeah, that you know, as they say, is with superheroes with great power comes great responsibility. I think that is outside of superheroes. I think that that's everybody, right? And you start to tap into yourself. When you tap into your own personal power. There's a great responsibility there to be be of service to yourself first, and then to be a service to others. So cause, how can I be of service to others if I'm not taking care of me?

Shakira: Yeah, yeah. I don't think that those thank you for that, for sharing that. I think, I don't believe that that statement has been, it really made sense to me. For a long time it's taken, you know, we'll say 42 years, for me to get it. To understand the importance of what it means to have integrity to myself, which is not the right phrase, I know, I'm articulating that poorly. But for me, to be able to trust other people, it does require this kind of trusting relationship with myself. For me to be able to be forgiving of other people. It requires me to have self compassion and forgive myself. Those lessons aren't something that I can outwardly give, unless I am inwardly doing that nurturing, I guess what I'm saying is what? No, Jackson, that's my dog licking my lip gloss? Not his lip gloss my lip gloss?

Jill: This is why you have it.

Shakira: Yes, squirrel, I just lost my train of thought. I think what I'm what I'm trying to say is that I that lesson, and I guess the summon up really wasn't something that made sense to me, it felt really selfish, I thought I could bypass the sort of, you know, self compassion, the integrity with one's values and oneself, you know, all of the things that felt like, in fact, the opposite of being in service to someone else would be sort of this focus on myself. And that's not the point I think it is. There's something to be said about, you know, what is the relationship with self first, you know, what does that look like, in order to create the kinds of relationships that I want with other people? And you only do that by some introspection in that sort of commitment to yourself.

Jill: Absolutely. I think that that's I'm on that same thought process with you is that I think as much as we like to say that we can be all of the things do all of the things with other people, we can't do those things effectively, if we're not connected to ourselves. And I find myself in various situations, like if I'm going out and doing something and with people, and I'm completely feeling connected with myself, I have a totally different experience, than if I'm not feeling great about myself, or I'm not feeling connected or grounded and I haven't done my typical things that allow me to feel connected to myself, then I have a different experience. It almost feels like I'm if I'm disconnected from self, I'm disconnected from the situation and the people around me. If I'm connected to self, I'm connected to everything around me.

Shakira: So true. Agree, that interdependency word pops up in my head again? Yeah. as sort of a reflection of that, what is it take for you to be connected to yourself? Like, is it a big is it was it? You know, I think one of the things that we'll say, prevents me, but that I've had to learn, again, sort of over time doesn't take much for me now, to understand what are the true like, take, what's the golden ticket, you know, or maybe several golden tickets of connecting with self in order to therefore sort of be grounded and in, you know, reality and presence with the world around me? What is it? What does that look like for you? How do you gain that retain that? Yeah. You know what I mean?

Jill: I do. Maybe the question isn't clear. I don't know, it's clear. I think we've talked about this too, as far as like, just some of the little things that make me feel grounded and connected, are, if I'm journaling, if I'm moving my body in a way that feels good, if I'm doing things that nurture me, and that I, what's the word I want that I choose, make me feel connected to self, whatever those activities might be. Right? Like, I articulated a few of those. And if I'm feeling accepting of myself, right where I'm at, because I feel like that's always a big battle for me is body image and just image of self. So if I'm feeling confident and connected in that, then that changes my experience with a lot of different things. Because if I'm feeling like I need to hide something, or if I need to present something different, then I'm not connected to self. Mm hmm. Yeah. So loving acceptance of self and doing things in loving kindness that nurture me,

Shakira: Mm hmm, Yeah, I feel that I feel that Yeah.

Jill: How about for you? Same question.

Shakira: What was the question again?

Jill: Have you feel connected to yourself? Like, what do you do? What's your golden ticket to connection to self?

Shakira: meditation. Yeah, which I don't necessarily care for that word because to me, it prompts this thought of someone sitting cross legged, and, you know, a very special space with very special candles and very special everything around them, like it requires something outside of them to go inward. So I hesitate on saying that word, even though I recognize that probably what I'm doing in the pause of my life, of my day, is exactly that. It's a pause. That's it. So I It starts there. So when I get up in the morning, there's a couple things now that I do, that immediately put me in a space of presence in there, it's, it's shit that I never thought I would do. The older I get, the more I become like somebody's great, great black Auntie, you know, like, I find people to pray on the phone with and shit like that I remember. I remember I was going through a really what time once and Jess, you know, Jess, we had connected and she said something like, do you want to get on Zoom and just pray together? And I was like, Yes, I do. Yeah. And we spent maybe 10 minutes, exchanging like prayers for you know, both of our, you know, the shit that we were going through. Yeah. And I got off the phone. I was like, who am I, but also like, how great it was to share like a spiritually intimate moment with other people, or with someone special, and I think she's very special. So first thing in the morning, I'll get up, I will 90% of the time, now it's getting better, make my bed even with one eye open. It prevents me from getting back in. I know, this is nothing new to you. This is very new to me making my bed first thing in the morning.

Jill: It's all right. We all come to things at the right time and of our lives.

Shakira: Never thought that would be as important to me as it is to sort of set the tone for the day beginning. But the other key piece is I get on my knees. And I don't always have like a particular prayer, and most times I get on my knees and I always feel a little uncomfortable that I'm you know, my knees. And for me the act of getting on my knees is just a surrender to the day ahead of me. So it's I drop to my knees, and I usually close my eyes. And I allow what is going to come as a prayer to come. But I would say more most often it's just help. Yeah. Literally, like I'll just, you know, say help over and over. Not in a desperate way. But I think it's a calling in of again, higher yourself something bigger than me to sort of, you know, thy will be done.

Jill: And I also in that kind of experience it as a like you would set like you surrender to the day. And as far as like asking or stating help. It also feels like an opening to receive whatever guidance is available for you in that day.

Shakira: 100%. 100%. And that's my moment. And then I'll get up and lately I've been going to the gym in the morning instead of yeah, I'll go to the been going to the gym in the morning.

Jill: Wow. I really have rubbed off on you.

Shakira: Yeah, you have you know, I've really come lately and I was actually saying saying this on a group Texas and friends yesterday that I realized I cannot do this the evening gym thing. I mean, sure I can, especially if I decide in the morning, you know, like, yeah, I don't want to get up out of this bed right now this this weighted blanket is to good. But the amount of effort it takes me to get in that bitch in the evening is awful. It is so hard. And I never quite have like the the experience that I have in the morning. You know, I got it done. But I've never had the experience I have in the morning in the morning. It's it's just a really powerful time to sort of begin the day again, with this honoring of myself, to begin the day with integrity to begin the day, honoring that idea that procrastination prevents me from being of service to other people. And for me, the immediate next thing is the service of my job, which I have to think of, and a way of giving service right now because otherwise, there's this sense of like it's being put on me rather than I'm able to give it something give something to other people give something to you know, direct reports give something to my but like, I think that helps me a lot in getting through tough days, you know, getting through this feeling of you know, oh no, I have to do this rather than I get to do this.

Jill: Yeah, it's almost it's shifting the like what I was talking about earlier as far as like being responsible for yourself and be responsible for what's to come is that it gives a different light to it. And I loved how you would said like it's honoring thyself because here You are building in these in these steps you are building trust with yourself to say that hey, I can trust me I'm a safe space.

Shakira: Right? Right. I can do this. We can absolutely do this. It always feels good but yeah I struggle to still like there are some mornings especially when this is it's cold as shit. Like, I don't want to walk to the gym. Now I kind of do because I have some really great winter gear. And it wasn't until I lived in Minnesota where it was like it's not about you know, the weather. It's about like, how you gear

Jill: up. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Gotta have all the great boots. Great. Yeah.

Shakira: Oh, man. My boots are so good. My coat so good. I got one of those balaclavas. You know now Yeah, I mean, girl. Oh, one time I was walking to get my wings from down the street for dinner one day and I want my ski goggles and I walked in and the girl was like, Okay, I love the goggles. I'm like girl I don't play.

Jill: Fucking ski goggles in Chicago. You gotta be kidding. But I'd love to see, I have my mukluks from Steigers here in Ely.

Shakira: So I've heard the brand. I don't know them.

Jill: Oh, my God. I don't know about them. I bought them two years ago now. And I literally cannot wait until I get to put them on my feet because they don't leave my feet all winter long. So warm, I fucking love them. And I bet yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's all about like investing in the beautiful things to make winter tolerable. Yeah. And to make it enjoyable.

Shakira: Make it exactly because I hate being cold. I hate going out there and my eyelashes are freezing to my face. And you're the condensation from a nose and my mouth like in my face gets all dry and wind beat up like I hate that shit. But you put me in the right shit. Especially if my feet are warm. Girl, I can be out there.

Jill: It's great goggles at all.

Shakira: I love it. Pick up my six piece. Yes.

Jill: I miss being able to walk places. Okay. All right. So we'll hohum All right. Last question.

Shakira: Okay, what do you want to let go of?

Jill: That's a deep question. My silence is me pondering. What do I want to let go? The need to please. Want to expand on that? Why yes, yes, I do. I still feel like there's a part of me. And it's not a big part, as it used to be like, I've definitely brought so much more awareness into my people pleasing. But I still feel like there's a piece of that, that it's this like that gaining approval from others outside of self, to really be my true self. And there might always be a little bit of that because. I also don't want to be like a total asshole. But I also want to have boundaries for myself, and be totally okay with those and not have to feel like I need to have guilt or shame around that. And I feel like I've, you know, talked about this for the last couple of years is like allowing myself to be unapologetically me, and I think for the most part, I do that. But there's still a piece of me that is not that. So I feel like I want to let go of the things that people pleasing piece that holds me from being my true self.

Shakira: Yeah, I can definitely relate to that. For me, I interpret that as like this. Meaning maybe even said it external validation. Yeah. Driving sort of thoughts decisions next steps, all of it. Yeah, absolutely.

Jill: I think in the beginning of this with the first question, that also is part of my procrastination in this part of my distraction. Because there's things where it's just like, oh, well, if I don't do this thing, and I change how I want to behave, that's gonna maybe make somebody else upset or not like this new outcome. And it's just like, Oh, but I need to make sure that this person still likes me or because I don't want to change so much so that it's just like, Oh, you're, you're going to be gone, right? Because then it goes all the way back to this abandonment. Right. So like, it all comes back to the core. And it all is wrapped up in that piece that drives me and just being able to understand more of that abandonment. And how can I work with it, knowing that that is always going to be part of my story? Because that's my truth. Right? Like, it's so it's how do I let go of that, and still create the person that I want to be with that?

Shakira: Yeah, I feel like sometimes I forget that I have complete power over creating a new story. It doesn't always have to be I mean, it can be shaped by my past. You know, my new story shape can be shaped by experiences. But it's so all in my head. Sometimes I attach to the thoughts more than the possibility of, you know, or maybe to the positive sort of aspect of those thoughts that tell me like, I don't have to do that anymore.

Jill: Yeah, and I feel like throbbing for me it's releasing the word new story. Because it's not like, you know, because like when you go out and buy, you have a pair of tennis shoes that you really, really like, right, and you've worn them for your whole life. And all of a sudden they've broken down and you need a new pair of shoes, they're they're going to have new experiences, new roads, all of those things that they're going to experience on your feet from that day going forward. Right. And so I feel like in the word new, I don't necessarily want to like throw away those shoes, because those shoes have shaped me to where I am today. So when I buy that new pair, I'm going to have new experiences. But I got there because of that old pair of shoes. Right? So for me, it's like it's not about new, it's just about okay, how can how does my past shape my present? And how do I want my past to be a part of my future? So that I am writing the next chapter in my story, not necessarily a new story. Does that make sense?

Shakira: It does make sense and I've never considered that perspective for myself. I think I get so excited by new.

Jill: I think yeah, but I do love your perspective on the word, new I think I told you before, like I love January 1, I love you New Year's Day. I love the word new. For me, it feels like a cleanse. It feels like you know a shower of a friend that has the same relative to sobriety that you can't get clean off a yesterday shower, you know, so you have to start every day with a fucking new set of panties. If you wear them or a new you know, fresh swipe of deodorant, you know, a little water hitting the body a little you know. So I can stay in the present rather than attaching newness to the future, which feels like I'm not where I want to be. And maybe that's where my mind goes to how I hear it, you know from from your perspective for me, it's like, oh, no, it's new today. It's new right now. I love that feeling of new I love a new fuckin pair of shoes. I will tell you those old ones, because to me, they're in the past. But I get your point of where you associate new to sort of the structure to which you are constantly building. You know, in the in terms of your life, like I get it, newness of that feeling. Because I'm the same way like I love new clothes, new shoes, all like I do love it. This is gonna be something for me to ponder. Thank you. Yeah,

Shakira: Yeah. New day, new, you know, I don't like leftover. You don't like leftovers.

Jill: I'm getting better. I'm getting. Okay. Really? Just not leftover chicken. But I'm getting better. Yeah, yeah. All right. Well, I feel like this was a really good deep dive. Anything else that you want to add for this? Before we end and say goodbye to our friends?

Shakira: Yeah, maybe this was a little deeper than I anticipated?

Jill: Fuck, I would say. But that's where this is gonna go. I think potentially, it's gonna

Shakira: it's gonna be a surprise.

Jill: I mean, every time I think so.

Shakira: What else? What else do I want to say? I mean, I like everything that you said. I some of it, I guess to sort of wrap up, you know, or make a little summarize, I think where I started here, and that I feel like I know, almost everything about you. But all of that is sort of predicated upon my past experience. Hey, here we go. Me I'm making some connections, my past experience and my past knowledge of the things that we've shared in the past when we talk about today and where you are and what you want to let go of I didn't either. I didn't know. I didn't know as in but I also still relate, you know, because again, I think we sometimes have parallel life experiences relative to the journey or the path of where we want to go. So. Yeah,

Jill: yeah. I like it. I'm a new fucking pair of shoes every day. Yeah. Right. And I think that that's part of this journey is that in allowing ourselves to be accepting of ourselves and to be able to have the compassion that forgiveness is that awareness of I'm new every single day because yesterday's experiences are going to shape tomorrow me, which is going to be new. It's different than today. It's different than yesterday. So in your words, I am always new. Yeah, yeah. And to be able to see each other in that new lens to know that Shakira today is not Shakira tomorrow or yesterday.

Shakira: No I'm right here right now. This is it. Yeah

Jill: I love how you said like this is going to be a surprise every day because I think that that's what's gonna make this great. Yeah, yes, our friends our friends never know what the fuck is gonna come out of our mouths next now

Shakira: no I don't know what's gonna come out of my mouth whenBye I'm talking to you.

Jill: The glory the glory of us. All right, until next time, my friends. We will chat soon. Bye

Shakira: Byeee.